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Forget about goals and assists for a minute, I’m shocked that Berube didn’t separate AM and MM for DEFENSIVE purposes. The JT line was getting their faces caved in for most of the playoffs, why not switch MM and WN to get a little more defensive prowess on the second line?!? Mitch is a superior defender to Willy, I figure the switch was worth a look.
Not sure carolina is built the right way….I havent heard anyone say that.
But the leafs template hasnt worked in 9 years. You need top end scoring, depth scoring, big quality D, good goaltending and a willingness to consistently fight for every inch of the ice. The leafs have improved big quality D (although they are older) and good goaltending. – FakesieThe talking heads and pundits who talk about them at all, cause let’s face it it’s Carolina and nobody gives a fuck, talk about how they run 4 lines, they are all hard working, north/south guys and they play an “even better” team defense than Florida does. On paper they should be a better shut down team than Florida.
Cush.
Not sure marner needs a sniper to get points. Every playmaker needs a finisher and goal scorers need playmakers to get them the puck.
Everybody Marner has played has improved their scoring. I dont think Matthews gets to 69 without him and Marner doesnt get to 100pts without Matthews. But I think both could get close to those numbers if they didnt always play with eachother. They work great together. But youre a bit onsided against marner.What I find funny, is that Marner scores more without Matthews and Matthews has more assist withour Marner.
Here is an excerpt from a sportsnet article.
“What stands out to me most are the goals-to-assist rates.When Matthews is with Marner, he scores at nearly a 2:1 ratio of goals to assists, which is insane. In an admittedly small but relevant sample, Matthews has had more assists than goals without Marner. His points-per-game go up as well, and Matthews still scores at a 53-goal pace.
Marner also gets more points without Matthews in this limited sample, and it seems like he takes on more scoring responsibility without him. With more total points, Marner goes from scoring at a 0.3:1 goals-to-assist rate, to a scoring pace that would net him a 50-goal-season, as unsustainable as that may be.”
In the article they have a comparison chart. I couldnt paste the chart in here.
I hope the link works. Its from Feb 2025And yes, more skilled bottom 6 depth could have changed the tide in the leafs favour….had Lorentz scored on his breakaway it may have altered the game a bit. Panthers bottom 6 got to the leafs. Again no one said its the only reason, but it is part of the reason.
Like let’s try to be positive? Leafs have 9 consecutive years in the playoffs, including years they weren’t expected to make it. They also have shit the bed a bunch too.
~AaronInteresting to note, in those 9 years, 5 of the teams that eliminated the Leafs (assuming Florida does this year), went on to the Cup Finals. That’s not nothing.
Yes, the Leafs need some drastic changes up front, but holy shit this team is close. If they hadn’t shit the bed in game 7 at home, I think they’re in the Cup Finals. Tre came in to a bit of a shit show, and in just two years he’s shored up our D and tendies. Give him another year, maybe two, to get the forwards figured out, and I think we’ll see more success. Winning in professional sports is hard as fuck. The Wild have been eliminated in the first round 8 straight years, but nobody talks about that because they’re not the center of the hockey universe.
Aaron
Participant
I’ll add something additional. Considering Carolina and Florida both are “built the right way” and one of them has to lose this series like, you can build “tough” but it doesn’t matter because 31 teams a year lose. Colorado and the Blues and Kings all built the same way. Fuck the Oilers aren’t and they are in conference finals back to back years.Not sure carolina is built the right way….I havent heard anyone say that.
But the leafs template hasnt worked in 9 years. You need top end scoring, depth scoring, big quality D, good goaltending and a willingness to consistently fight for every inch of the ice. The leafs have improved big quality D (although they are older) and good goaltending.I’ll add something additional. Considering Carolina and Florida both are “built the right way” and one of them has to lose this series like, you can build “tough” but it doesn’t matter because 31 teams a year lose. Colorado and the Blues and Kings all built the same way. Fuck the Oilers aren’t and they are in conference finals back to back years. -Aaron
Is Carolina built ‘the right way’ though? They struggled to score a lot all season and it may come to bite them in the ass now we will see.
I also feel like the Canes were riding super hot goaltending in Freddy that might be coming down to earth (Where have we see that before?) and Florida just has more scoring power than they do.It’s game 1 so it’s early and Canes have one of if not the best motivating coaches in the NHL so I expect them to come out alot differently in game 2. Flordia was riding the game 7 win high and Canes were rested but cold. I think game 2 is a lot closer and different but Florida is so unpredictable who knows – they looked dead in the water vs the Leafs until the 3rd period really of game 3 and then they were the Florida team from last year.
Florida is now the ‘template’ teams will build around and they used the Tampa template, who used the Boston template.
Nobody is mimicking what the Leafs have done for nearly a decade now & quite honestly to some degree Toronto was stupid and arrogant to think it would work and as much as we want to blame Shanny or Dubas specifically for trying to be creative and do something never done before that’s not entirely accurate. Toronto followed the old Oilers template just with more success but not enough.
Oilers drafted in the top 3 for several years landing Hall, RNH, Yakapov etc. and sure they made some terrible picks but they kept drafting high skill and no real grit guys and failed. Dubas had some quote about drafting for skill and trading for grit – that is 100% the old Oilers and they failed. The Leafs had better options and drafted better but they are what most organizations who are looking to re-build now or soon are looking at and saying “Jesus boys lets make sure we draft to try and balance our roster not like what the Leafs did”.
Boston, Tampa, Florida – all highly successful for years – all more successful than Toronto.
Time to stop trying to guess what the answer on the test is and copy someone else’s work (or in this case move stuff around to try and get it as close as you can to their work).
I’ll add something additional. Considering Carolina and Florida both are “built the right way” and one of them has to lose this series like, you can build “tough” but it doesn’t matter because 31 teams a year lose. Colorado and the Blues and Kings all built the same way. Fuck the Oilers aren’t and they are in conference finals back to back years.
Cush you make some good points.
I will say this. Management are the ones to look at this through objective eyes and make changes. I rely on them to not overreact/over correct as many fans want. I have seen many, many fans saying to rebuild it and move Matthews because “he’s shit”.
Like let’s try to be positive? Leafs have 9 consecutive years in the playoffs, including years they weren’t expected to make it. They also have shit the bed a bunch too.
Recently they’ve lost to the panthers 2 out of 3 years in the 2nd round. Florida is becoming a “dynasty” type team. It still sucks and you gotta beat the best but this is where I have to agree I don’t see the killer instinct. Leafs had plenty of chances, like the Canadian division to make a run and couldn’t muster that instinct.
As for Rielly, I wouldn’t be opposed if he decided to leave or stay. Doesn’t matter to me. JT can come back. He’s been an effective 2nd liner, just needs a cheap contract. Marner I think he explores the free agency but who really will pay him 14 million?
