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I tend to agree. After Torts was fired, I really was skeptical with all the Tocchet bluster to the Flyers, even after he left VAN. If they were going retread route, I thought they would have pursued Sullivan a lot harder. It does seem like an old boy Flyers hire, which is sad. Rick Bowness came back to coach Columbus this year. 4 out of his last 5 years as HC his team made the playoffs. The ultimate win now coach with a better track record. A month after Tocchet was hired, Peter Deboer was fired by DAL.
For a front office that likes to show a public perception of being quiet and not say a lot, they sure seem to like to have HCs who do not know when to just shut up. Its a weird mixture. The Flyers will finish better in the standings then last season, but I find this team to be a hard watch most games. Just my opinion. The offensive output still stinks, so the concerns about the Tocchet hire do seem to be justified. Vladar has stolen them points this year and the goalie is part of the team. What track record is there to suggest Tocchet can turn the offense around? 1 year in now 10 years as HC his offense was not even middle of the road. The argument can be made well he never got to be a HC of a good team. Well, this is a league where HCs last about two years, so why did no good teams at the time hire Rick Tocchet. Seems like the relationship between Arizona and himself was mutually beneficial, both sides going nowhere. VAN ownership is known as not really stable. I would have thought that would have been more of a red flag for the regime.
I disagree with that perception but hard to disagree with the rest. DB and Jonesy have been here 3 years and every year they have to hold a major press conferences due to controversy
Year 1. Cutter. Whether or not people believe the Flyers had any fault in him leaving the PR media blitz was amateur hour. From Hilferty->Jones->Torts they just trashed this kid loudly and often. That was not professional at all.
Year 2. Torts abusing York and separately Torts publicly quitting on the team was a national PR nightmare for the Flyers
Year 3. Tocchet’s incomprehensible press conferences where he had to mention Michkov reported to camp out of shape, even if it wasn’t relevant to the question asked caused DB to call for a press conference just to address it. Not to mention Jonesy has had no problem discussing on the record that plan A this year was to buy an elite center/d in FA, that the plan predictably failed, and that there is no plan B.The Tocchet fit was odd from the start because throughout his entire HC career his teams were never offensive juggernauts. Now, the argument is Tocchet really never had a chance to coach a really good team. Well, with the shelf life of HCs in the NHL lasting 2 years, one would think a playoff team would have looked at Tocchet as a must have coach to put them over the top if he was viewed that way.
For a team that relies on undersized wings to drive offensive play to use a system which is not dependent on generating speed into the offensive zone seems like a bad fit. I had no issue not making Shaw the HC over the summer. My personal choice was Ferschweiler because Carle was a pipe dream. Just because Hakstol did not not work does not mean close the door on college HCs. There were some good options at the AHL level which were intriguing. Alas, the Flyers hire a retread with 1 true playoff appearance in 9 years. Torts made 12 playoff appearances in his career. I am no fan of Torts, but firing a HC who was probably on his last HC job to replace him with a HC on probably his last HC job in a rebuild seemed like an odd choice.
That’s because it’s not a rebuild. The Flyers have been trying to make the playoffs all along. Viewed through that lens it all makes sense. Remember it wasn’t until towards the end of his final season as coach that Torts accepted that this wasn’t a playoff caliber roster. Michkov and Martone were a product of organizational failure, not planning on the Flyers part.
Flyers last 13 games
7 OT (2 OTL, 1 OTL win, 4 Shoot outs)In the last 10 games the Flyers have less than 20 SOG 4 times.
In the last 10 games the Flyers opponents have had 23+ SOG 10 times.The Flyers have 3 regulation wins since 1/23/26. 2 of them were against the capitals.
In 9 overtime games in 2026 the Flyers have scored 1 goal (Michkov). In 23 OT this season the Flyers have scored 3 goals. Michkov is tied for the lead despite not being out for OT for the first 18 games.
If Vladar plays well and keeps this a low scoring game, I’d say the odds are pretty good that the game goes to OT and the shootout. The odds are if anything else happens they will lose.
I do agree this no longer a destination franchise. Having players waive NMC to come here is going to be unlikely. The few times an elite talent becomes available without a NMC (ie Quinn Hughes), the organization cannot just say “oh well, we got outbid”. Since free agency is not an option and the current regime has no interest in team stripping to get close to top 5 for the next couple of drafts, the only way forward is more Zegras and Jiricek trades. Players who have not lived up to their pre draft hype. That’s why the team has to be willing to move Tippett and/or Foerster this summer. See if they can get Berniers out of SEA. Another organization going no where with a high draft pick who has not lived up to his hype on a long-term contract. Notice he does not have a NMC clause. The regime will need some luck and a HC to maximize the skill of Michkov and Martone. I’m not sure which is more likely- getting the luck needed to win big in Zegras type trades or the current HC who can maximize his players’ performance.
how can any person have any faith in tocchet is baffling. returning players have regressed.
agree with pretty much the rest.
zegras has a nice bounce back season no doubt. that being said he has cooled off a lot since the new year. will be interesting to see what type of contract he wants/ends up signing. Is he a guy you commit 8 years to? I am sure the flyers think so.
with the way the flyers draft their best bet is a trade. though danny refuses to move off is “guys”. severely overrates them and places way too high a value.
It’s actually been since Christmas (nitpicking i know). Since then he’s scored 17 pts in 29 games or a pace of 48 pts over a season. He got the majority of his points early in the season at winger. I still can’t believe it took them 50+ games to try him at center. They did themselves no favors in evaluating him. Is he a center or winger? 2nd line or 3rd line on a contending team? He hasn’t been healthy 2 out of the last 3 years and he’s currently making 5.75 mill/yr. He’s 1 year from UFA coming off a bridge deal with the Flyers already talking up how much cap room they have and want to spend. He’s going to want some of that UFA money.
The Flyers do overrate their own players as we see time and time again. Dvorak, despite getting 1st line minutes has been 17 pts in 29 games since Christmas or a 39 point pace over a season.
This is why you start with the elite core players and build around them. If the Flyers had a McDavid or Celebrini for example allowing both Dvorak and Zegras slot lower in the lineup with less pressure which also helps the lower lines have better line mates and everyone’s situation improves. How can you evaluate them for the job they should have if you can’t/don’t slot them properly? The Flyers would rather have a 3rd line player average 20 min/game over the last 10 games because Flyers media will rubber stamp anything they do and it’s easier than doing what is necessary.
Who is the core of this team and where should those player actually be slotted? What is the timeline? Konecny and Sanheim will both be in their 30s next year, signing them long term was a huge mistake if they the Flyers aren’t competing for a cup now. Listening to Jonesy it sounded like their go time was NOW before all the elite UFA talent dried up.
How do you fall to 30th in SOG (29th in Shots against) and think the team is headed in the right direction?
Because last year this team had 76 points, this year they’re on pace for 92. Sixteen point improvement. Last year they gave up 286 goals, 3.49 per game. this year 3.01. About a half goal a game. This is not complicated when you understand grade school math.
I know you are smarter than your posts make you sound and you just like to shit post but let’s go ahead.
Your analysis ends in grade school and anyone who completed above elementary would understand the fallacy. 2 years ago the Flyers were on pace on pace for 92 points after 72 games before collapsing down the stretch, which was an improvement over the 75 point finish the year before. Sound familiar? Yet they finished with 87 and went right back to mid 70s this past year. Why?
Winning in unsustainable ways. Sure for the short term you can get lucky and have the illusion of progress. Puck luck and things break your way or in the case this year of a hot goalie. Those things pale long term over a well built team with talent and coaching. The underlying math (the stuff you find beyond grade school) shows that the Flyers aren’t built or building for the long term. Winning a few more games because Vladar is standing on his head doesn’t mean the forwards, defense, or coaching have improved.
Goals for is worse, PP is back down to 32nd, Shots dropped several spots to 30th, PK is worse, etc.
The team is unwatchable at times with the slow grinding play but hey as long as Vladar stops 30 SOG a game in a year that should focus on rebuilding for the long term all is good? No. That’s the same shit different year.
The underlying numbers are more important than the topline numbers to the team’s health long term. The team’s future is on life support.
The Flyers rebuild was always a lie. Rather than draft elite talent they wanted to buy it and then were shocked, absolutely shocked, that they can’t.
The Flyers gambled that the casual fan wouldn’t look behind the curtain and keep supporting them. You are proof of how gullible Flyers fans can be as long as you give them a show.
The Flyers are one of the worst teams in the league only being kept on life support due to playing to get to the shoot out every game. They lead the league in number of shoot outs and shoot out wins. 2 things which will not happen in the playoffs. They play boring low event hockey (that can’t be questioned because Tocchet is god apparently).
SOW..SOL…G…..GA….DIFF..PP%…PK%…S/GP..S%…SA/GP..SV%
1st..20th..26th..15th..20th..32nd..21st..30th..17th..29th..25thOther than Vladar’s numbers, everything across the board is worse than last year but a segment of the fan base wants to stick their fingers in their ears because the Flyers aren’t eliminated yet. Another game where the Flyers didn’t deserve to make it to the shoot out. What is it now, 3 goal in 23 OT? None of them scored by Konecny, Tippet, Zegras, risto, drysdale.
How do you fall to 30th in SOG (29th in Shots against) and think the team is headed in the right direction?
Mission Critical should be drafting as high as possible.
Bettman instituted the current OT/shoot out rules to keep teams that would normally be eliminated by February in the playoff hunt to keep asses in the seats. Gate revenue is king in the NHL. The Flyers are one of those teams that benefits the most from that. Some of the most boring low event hockey in the league. Another under 20 SOG game. Nobody has gone to the shoot out more than the Flyers
2025
SOW..SOL…G…..GA….DIFF..PP%…PK%…S/GP..S%…SA/GP..SV%
1st..18th..24th..28th..29th..30th..20th..26th..17th..25th..32nd2026
SOW..SOL…G…..GA….DIFF..PP%…PK%…S/GP..S%…SA/GP..SV%
1st..20th..26th..15th..20th..32nd..21st..30th..17th..29th..25thThe Flyers are a worse team by almost every metric other than SV% and while it is nice to see that improve it is almost solely due to Vladar’s career year and not sustainable. SOG fell to 30th, SOG/against fell to 29th. PP is back to last in the league, where it belongs. Other than giving up fewer goals this team has regressed almost across the board with Shoot Out wins the only thing giving Tocchet truthers any hope.
A competent front office would not be in this situation year after year. How many NHL hall of shame records have been set under Fletcher and now Briere? The Front office whose only plan was to buy elite talent in FA this year which has already admittedly failed.
I thought it couldn’t get worse than Torts, be careful what you wish for. Even Tocchet’s press conferences sound incomprehensible half the time.
What an asshole and one of Tocchet’s best buds.
Bill, any chance you’d call out anybody in the media for being an asshole?
Long term the shoot out wins don’t help the Flyers but playing/developing the kids do. No team plays for the shootout as much as the Flyers.
How about a shoutout to Andrae, the forgotten Flyers defenseman, scoring an important regulation goal for the Flyers.
not going to get on them for letting him walk. didn’t they have to qualify him which was much more than league min?
just find it funny he was on waivers then month later key to a flyers trade
https://sports.yahoo.com/article/flyers-letting-jakob-pelletier-clear-220505900.html
$840k vs the $775k that Tampa is paying him. Not really much of a difference but even Tampa waived him again at the beginning of the season. Good for him for having a good year in the AHL.
https://thehockeynews.com/nhl/philadelphia-flyers/latest-news/ex-flyers-forward-dominating-the-ahl
Seems like the Flyers totally screwed up with Pelletier. Not that he was ever going to be a great NHLer but for league minimum to lead the AHL team and to have available for callup it was a missed opportunity.
Flyers Youth Movement Starts With Them & Ends With Tocchet
If the Flyers lean into a youth movement, the question is how head coach Rick Tocchet goes about it. The critique of the coach throughout the season is how he deploys ice time, specifically, with Michkov and the other young skaters. Furthermore, he’s been quick to scratch younger players for mistakes or for not checking, which explains why Nikita Grebenhkin, another prospect in the system, has spent multiple games in the press box.As to the argument that Tocchet was the worst coach you could pick for the team, the above is argument #1. The Flyers main concern should be how to best evaluate and develop their young talent rather than focusing on continuing to lead the league in grinding out low scoring shoot out games in an attempt to get a few more points.
Tocchet was the guy they brought in to make the playoffs and entice elite talent FAs that Philly is a destination, not a roadstop. Both of which he has failed at. The least the Front office can do, the absolute least, is to find out what works out best with the kids.
Nobody is going to think less of Tocchet if accepts reality and cuts the kids some slack but of course he “has his own thoughts about that”.
Speaking of draft picks and the Rangers, how about Gabe Perrault. The consensus draft pick the Flyers should’ve picked instead of Bonk. Not that the Flyers need any more wingers but nobody thought Bonk was the better pick on draft day and who knows how things will be in 5 years but today, it’s looking really bad.
Bonk has yet to play in the NHL and Perrault looked pretty good last night against the Flyers.
https://www.blueshirtbanter.com/rangers-vs-flyers-fun-in-this-economy/
Some serious things, though. Gabe Perreault has looked like an actual man of late, specifically when Mike Sullivan was forced to play him as a top line player. He had a goal and an assist last night (he had another assist taken away as well), and his behind the back pass to Mika Zibanejad was a thing of true beauty. The kid has ridiculous vision on the ice, and to have the confidence to even attempt that pass let alone pull it off is something else. Good for him, man. Good for us, too.
You see quotes like that and you think, the Flyers were not the smartest guys in the room on draft day or when picking coaches.
Their focus has always been to lowkey make the playoffs and their fallback for failure is to keep repeating “rebuilding” to the public. Kind of a have your cake and eat it to. No accountability. Remember when they threw a bunch of money at Fedotov to come over and save their playoff dreams 2 years ago with 10 games left in the season? Good times.
Then Torts quit when he realized they weren’t going to make the playoffs last year and now Tocch, the coach that free agents want to play for, is hired to get them over the hump. I don’t really think DB should get credit for Martone because he was a reward for failure, they weren’t trying to be bad, they were kind of like the Leafs who thought they were better than they actually were but the Flyers still had their 1st rnd pick. And in the end Martone is a luxury, not a necessity. If Hagens or O’Brien, who were drafted immediately after Martone, succeed as #1 centers, this will go down as a miss for DB regardless of how well Martone does. You have to wonder, if the front office had known at the draft that their Tocchet luring FA elite talent to the Flyers super plan was going to fail, would they have drafted differently? Neither of the centers are 6’3″ like Martone though so probably not. Being the biggest is the #1 attribute they were looking for.
none of that changes the fact he has regressed and done jack shit. 2 teams have moved on from him, why?
post the flyers winning %
I just explained it to you, you fucking idiot. Bill Guerin explained it to you. You know far less about hockey than me let alone Guerin. He was buried with a team deep on D.
The Flyers, despite their horrific 2-8-4 stretch, are on pace for 92 points. Two teams made the playoffs last year with 92 points. The weather is getting nicer. Maybe you should pull your head out of your ass and enjoy it.
I hate to get in the middle of you 2 arguing but this take aged horribly in less than 24 hours.
This team isn’t making the playoffs and I hope, while not yet mathematically eliminated, the game last night was the final nail in the reality of that.
The Rangers are probably pissed that the Flyers are ruining their tank.
I agree in the sense that I don’t see an identifiable plan about what identity they are establishing and who will be the nucleus to emerge down the middle (both at C and D).
Thank you! This is what we’ve been saying all year! Not sure why it took 62 games to admit this. Even the Flyers postgame came out and said this team is cooked (once they determined they shouldn’t be playing the 76ers music).
Vladar has been covering up a directionless team all year. When he’s off they lose. When he’s really off, they lose big.
Can we also admit that Jones’s plan to buy C1, C2, and D1 in free agency this year was not so much a plan as a wish list? They don’t have a backup plan.
I still don’t see what they were thinking when they hired Tocchet, other than they thought they were able to go to the playoffs this year and, going back to my previous statement on FA, that the elite talent would want to flock to PHI to play for Tocch.
